Possible Spindle Upgrade - 600W or More

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ajacocks
Posts: 35
Joined: Mon Feb 10, 2014 7:14 pm

Possible Spindle Upgrade - 600W or More

Post by ajacocks » Tue Feb 09, 2016 8:11 pm

I'm currently using a DW660 on my S2/X-Carve, and was thinking of upgrading to something better, given the lack of flexibility of that router. The best options that I have found are either the DW611, which most seem to use, or a 600W+ mini-spindle (Inventables, or Chinese).

The major problems with the 611, that I see, are the huge weight on the already somewhat flexible X carriage (mine is not yet bolted together, but I have plans to do so), and the lack of PWM speed control, without a SuperPID, which adds considerably to the cost.

The Inventables 600w needs a power supply and speed control, but I found this controller, which is clearly a Chinese design, but available from a US seller:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/RioRand-12V-24V ... SwqrtWnscD
Since that will take 100v AC, it just needs a line cord, and a PWM link to the controller that I am using (X Controller).

What does anyone think of the performance of the 600w Quiet Cut, with a proper power supply? I have not seen many posts on that, I'm guessing because Inventables doesn't sell a power supply or speed control for it.

I'm also open to other VFD-powered spindles, if they are known to be reliable.

Thanks!
- Alex
Shapeoko 2 #3250

cvoinescu
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Location: Camberley, UK
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Re: Possible Spindle Upgrade - 600W or More

Post by cvoinescu » Tue Feb 09, 2016 8:27 pm

All attempts (that I know of) to use that type of speed controller with mains voltage have ended up in smoke, quite literally. It may work with 160 VDC or even exactly 110 VAC if you had that, but you probably actually have 120 VAC, give or take (usually give). That's above the stated rating, which is quite possibly a lie to begin with.

Also, the isolation between the supply and the control input is not up to snuff on the ones I've got (they look identical and claim 110 VAC too, so I'm pretty sure yours would be the same). I would not plug that thing into the mains: I want to live to old age.
Proud owner of ShapeOko #709, eShapeOko #0, and of store.amberspyglass.co.uk

ajacocks
Posts: 35
Joined: Mon Feb 10, 2014 7:14 pm

Re: Possible Spindle Upgrade - 600W or More

Post by ajacocks » Wed Feb 10, 2016 5:55 pm

cvoinescu,

Thanks for the note. I hadn't really given the electronics in the controller a detailed look, yet. So, it sounds like a 110 VDC power supply would be a good investment, or to go the whole distance and get a VFD-controlled spindle.

Any thoughts on my other question of a 600W (or 800W) spindle vs. the Dewalt 611? Am I fooling myself that there is room for improvement on the trim router, for a Shapeoko-type machine?

Thanks!
- Alex
Shapeoko 2 #3250

oskanaan
Posts: 26
Joined: Tue Jan 27, 2015 6:47 am

Re: Possible Spindle Upgrade - 600W or More

Post by oskanaan » Thu Feb 11, 2016 11:19 pm

I am a regular dw660 user and happy with it, but I decided to try the 600w spindle. I've just received it today so I'll try it over the weekend and tell you how much of a difference was it :).

ajacocks
Posts: 35
Joined: Mon Feb 10, 2014 7:14 pm

Re: Possible Spindle Upgrade - 600W or More

Post by ajacocks » Thu Feb 11, 2016 11:31 pm

I'll be curious to hear...please also let us know what power supply and speed control you used.

Thanks!
- Alex
Shapeoko 2 #3250

oskanaan
Posts: 26
Joined: Tue Jan 27, 2015 6:47 am

Re: Possible Spindle Upgrade - 600W or More

Post by oskanaan » Sat Feb 13, 2016 11:03 am

ajacocks wrote:I'll be curious to hear...please also let us know what power supply and speed control you used.
I purchased the item on this link, which comes with a power supply.

I've tried it today and after connecting all the wires and turning it on, it didnt run at all. It turned out that the problem was that I tightened the spindle mount too much. After loosening the mount screws a little bit, I was able to make it work.

The first thing I noticed after running it for about 3 minutes is that the spindle became extremely hot and I even burned my finger a little bit touching it. I tried setting the speed to lower than max, I guess it would be something around 11000 RPM, but still the spindle became hot. Rotating the spindle fan by hand wasnt fluid at first, but after running the first job (20 minutes) it became more easy to rotate it by hand.

I had a project with Western Cedar wood, which is a very soft wood, and I tried the following:

- I ran a toolpath to level a board at (.125" bit, 70 in/min feed, 80% stepover, depth .01"), some areas on the board where higher than others but I noticed that the spindle struggles a bit with this sort of speed. I could run this with ease on my DW660.
- Pocket toolpath with the following settings (.125" bit, 35 in/min, 40% stepover, .1" depth of cut). It was too easy and I didnt notice any stress on the spindle. I usually use a 50 in/min on DW660 with no stress on it.
- Profile toolpath with the following settings (.125" bit, 40 in/min, .1" depth of cut). no issues. Probably can handle a faster cut.

I have another project on a Yaka wood board, which is much harder than Cedar, so I'll try to use the same speeds as above and see how it fairs.

I dont think this spindle is as powerful as a DW660, but it is much much more quite. I ran my machine at 11 PM for the first time in my life without worrying about the noise. Although I have an enclosure for my CNC, it couldnt contain the DW660 noise, but now, the only loud noise I can hear is the sound of wood being cut and the enclosure can contain the noise. I still have to figure out why is the spindle getting too hot, I've contacted the seller and waiting for his input on this issue, other than that, I'd be more than happy to use this DC spindle instead of my DW660 :).

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