Tapmatic and Vortec Cold Air Gun

Post Reply
jbc
Posts: 95
Joined: Sun Aug 23, 2015 3:15 pm
Location: Visalia, CA
Contact:

Tapmatic and Vortec Cold Air Gun

Post by jbc » Mon Nov 23, 2015 7:44 pm

Anyone use Tapmatic for a dry-lube solution?
I just heard from a guy on Vectric's website liking this stuff.
http://www.lpslabs.com/product-details/632

Also has anyone used Vortec's Cold Air Gun for aluminum?
https://www.vortec.com/p-273-dual-nozzle-mini-cag.aspx

I have one coming Wednesday. It should help a lot when cutting metal.
They are spendy-$300 (with the filter) but I'm hoping it pays for itself avoiding material cost's lost to failed jobs and the lost bits due to heat (wear).

Thoughts?

The search feature didn't bring any hits back for the Cold Air Gun and only a mention on Tapmatic.
jbc
jbc
VCarvePro 8
3D Printing prototypes
Sketchup
http://www.CaffeineMachine.com

DanMc
Posts: 257
Joined: Fri Apr 13, 2012 3:34 am

Re: Tapmatic and Vortec Cold Air Gun

Post by DanMc » Mon Nov 23, 2015 8:10 pm

Hope you have a big air compressor :) those things suck down 8cfm.
I'll be interested to see how it works out.

WillAdams
Posts: 8488
Joined: Mon Apr 09, 2012 6:11 pm
Location: Pennsylvania --- south of the Turnpike, East of US-15
Contact:

Re: Tapmatic and Vortec Cold Air Gun

Post by WillAdams » Mon Nov 23, 2015 8:12 pm

Yeah, it wouldn't take too many endmills for that to pay for itself.

It also pretty much puts to bed my idea of cooling using the air from the router's fan --- how much of a compressor does this need?

We did find an academic paper on milling w/o coolant, using compressed air, which is listed on the books page, but I can't recall anything else concrete.
Shapeoko 3XL #0006 w/Makita RT0701 Router w/0.125″ and ¼″ Elaire precision collets
Nomad 883 Pro #596 (bamboo)

CrazyBillybob
Posts: 197
Joined: Mon Dec 16, 2013 2:09 pm
Location: Ohio
Contact:

Re: Tapmatic and Vortec Cold Air Gun

Post by CrazyBillybob » Mon Nov 23, 2015 9:06 pm

I'm not sure about the tapmatic dry lube but it sounds a lot like Boelube http://www.yardstore.com/browse.cfm/4,6260.html It was developed by Boeing and is environmentally friendly.... Best of all it works Great. I use it on Drill bits, Taps and saw blades. (now you've got me thinking it needs to be used on my end mills too!) We mainly use it on metal (ferrous and non-ferrous) but have had goo luck on some woods too (we had some very hard cherry that we could not get the screws to drive into well... rub a little on the screw and it jump in nice and tight.) I try and keep a tube or two on hand all the time.

The cold air guns look like an hour with a lathe and you could make one for a few bucks. The Plastic adjustable nozzles are cheap from Places on line or Enco, even some wood working stores carry it. There's just not much to it , Nozzle, expansion chamber, base and some plastic tubing. Unless there's a bunch more in the stainless tube then just an expansion chamber.

CBB

jbc
Posts: 95
Joined: Sun Aug 23, 2015 3:15 pm
Location: Visalia, CA
Contact:

Re: Tapmatic and Vortec Cold Air Gun

Post by jbc » Mon Nov 23, 2015 10:21 pm

CrazyBillybob wrote: The cold air guns look like an hour with a lathe ......
I googled cold air gun and saw somewhere a guy made something from trash and hooked it up to his compressor.
Fast air pushes the chips out of the way and keeps bit temps down...a little is better than none.
CrazyBillybob wrote:I'm not sure about the tapmatic dry lube but it sounds a lot like Boelube http://www.yardstore.com/browse.cfm/4,6260.html......
I love options. Not sure if I started buying different brands of lube my wife would understand. But I'm willing to find out.....if the cold air gun+lube triples my feed rate and doubles the life of my bits....and drops my failure rate I'll lube myself up every morning!
WillAdams wrote: Yeah, it wouldn't take too many endmills for that to pay for itself.
Exactly

DanMc wrote:Hope you have a big air compressor :) those things suck down 8cfm.
I'll be interested to see how it works out.
I don't have a large compressor but I know where I can get one. :D
I have a crappy 150PSI 5 gallon one from Lowes to start with. I don't expect that little thing to do more than to educate me as I head toward another compressor.
Which leads to another question - Which is a bigger money hole?
A boat?
A CNC machine?


I would have bought a larger compressor anyway. Love having one in the shop to keep things clean and keep the tires of bikes and my truck pumped up.

jbc
jbc
VCarvePro 8
3D Printing prototypes
Sketchup
http://www.CaffeineMachine.com

DanMc
Posts: 257
Joined: Fri Apr 13, 2012 3:34 am

Re: Tapmatic and Vortec Cold Air Gun

Post by DanMc » Tue Nov 24, 2015 12:31 pm

I found out the hard way about cfm years ago. Bought a top of the line French hvlp gun only to find that after 5 minutes spraying all I got was a sputter. Agreed though, having a large compressor is pretty nice. One thing to do when your compressor is undersized is to get a larger secondary reservoir and keep that at the max pressure your compressor will do, it probably still won't hold up for long milling jobs but if the use is intermittent it allows the compressor to catch up without a drop in pressure at the point of use.

jbc
Posts: 95
Joined: Sun Aug 23, 2015 3:15 pm
Location: Visalia, CA
Contact:

Re: Tapmatic and Vortec Cold Air Gun

Post by jbc » Wed Nov 25, 2015 5:23 am

DanMc wrote:I found out the hard way about cfm years ago. Bought a top of the line French hvlp gun only to find that after 5 minutes spraying all I got was a sputter.
Huge point DanMc

I've started researching compressors and found the cost leaps when going from approx. 5 cfm VS 8 or higher CFM.
I think the saleswoman told me that lower cfm will lower the temp the gun can deliver though not by much. I plan to get some clarification. Hopefully there is a small curve that makes this viable at lower CFM's.
I hope I can see a big difference cutting aluminum with the new compressor coming Monday (5.3 cfm continuous / 10 gal tank) and being hooked up to the cold air gun.
If I don't get the max temp drop that might be ok being these things, like most are designed for industrial purposes.

That being said,
Vortec Cold Air Gun $350 Dlvd (2nd-Day Air)
Compressor 5.3 CFM @ 90PSI (continuous) $300 Dlvd (on sale at Amazon from California Air Tools 39% discount on a quiet compressor)
(after tax and 2 day shipping for Vortec) $650 for this test :shock:
If it kicks ass I'll feel better in a month.

I almost put together a system another guy setup for his machine in the UK which worked out well for him.
The cost I was going to fork over was $162.55, all from Amazon.
-Aquarium pump -
-Loc-line coolant hose magnetic base super kit

I almost went this route but the allure of even colder cutting had me drooling. BUT I didn't recognize the CFM issue DanMc alerted me too.
At 1/4 of the cost it should be worth checking out.
The article discussed an aquarium pump purchased from the UK.
I researched and found this one and the rest of what I was going to need to try this out from here in the U.S.

If someone wants to try this out (I am strangely out of cash) and let us know how it works out i'll list the parts as I found them on Amazon. The pricing would have been my delivered cost for being an Amazon Prime member.
Hydrofarm AAPA70L 60-Watt 70-LPM Active Aqua Commercial Air Pump with 8 outlets- $47.21
Loc-line Coolant Hose Magnetic Base Manifold Super Kit, 25 piece, 1/4" - $83.89
Loc-line Coolant Hose Component, Acetal Copolymer, Wre Connector, 1/4" Hose ID (Pack of 2) - $6.29
Loc-line Coolant Hose Assembly Pliers, for 1/4" Coolant Hose System- $12.78
Tax - $12.38

=$162.55
jbc
VCarvePro 8
3D Printing prototypes
Sketchup
http://www.CaffeineMachine.com

jbc
Posts: 95
Joined: Sun Aug 23, 2015 3:15 pm
Location: Visalia, CA
Contact:

Re: Tapmatic and Vortec Cold Air Gun

Post by jbc » Wed Nov 25, 2015 6:49 pm

I found the post on the aquarium pump;
http://www.cnczone.com/forums/benchtop- ... forum.html

jbc
jbc
VCarvePro 8
3D Printing prototypes
Sketchup
http://www.CaffeineMachine.com

Post Reply