Random thought: double Y rail - Possible?

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jkanzaki
Posts: 166
Joined: Sat May 05, 2012 3:00 am

Random thought: double Y rail - Possible?

Post by jkanzaki » Mon Oct 14, 2013 8:20 am

There doesn't seem to be much discussion on double Y rail, I am curious to see has anyone done it?

I've attached two photo to illustrate my thoughts. This can be expensive because of adding additional 2 maker slide on both Y axis [ plus additional V wheels, 70mm bolt, spacers, washers etc to make this work ] , but I have some speculation would be improve stability and having some Scaling up advantage:

such as stronger Y rail - less deflection on the carriage unit ( assuming double X axis is over a meter ) ?


I did found in other post by adding additional driveshaft to solve the z axis deflection issue.
Image

Or add a ADDITIONAL aluminium extrusion between the gantry like how tweak modify his shapeoko
https://www.dropbox.com/sc/59zhqnqm3hq8 ... .41.23.jpg

I assume those mod add stability to the gantry.

Okie, back to my original post, I've posted two images below to show what I mean. I place the plate above my two spare makerslide illustrate my point.
Curious to see what other people think.

Cheers
Attachments
photo 2.JPG
photo 2.JPG (101.6 KiB) Viewed 2381 times
photo 1.JPG
photo 1.JPG (119.95 KiB) Viewed 2381 times
Shapeoko 1 - dissassemble
Shapeoko 2 - 1 x 1m expansion TinyG, superPid, Dw660, Aluminum extrusion bed, Nema 23, acme, Z axis upgrade, Dual Y
Shapeoko 3 - 0051 Stock Dw611, SuperPid, limit switch, 9mm belt

tweak
Posts: 34
Joined: Thu Aug 29, 2013 7:24 pm

Re: Random thought: double Y rail - Possible?

Post by tweak » Mon Oct 14, 2013 8:58 am

I went with steel v-wheels on X and Y axis, and it has stabilized the Z axis by a huge margin. The original ShapeOko plates were to thin for my 1m x 0.75m makerslides, causing it to bend noticably, but now I've replaced it with two sandwiched New-ShapeOko motorplates on each side, and it's rock solid.
ShapeOko hybrid, Dual X & Y Axis, ACME Z Axis, All NEMA 17, Kress 1050 FME-1 spindle (1.05KW), Steel V-Wheels & Hardcoat MakerSlide, Aluminum spacers, TinyG Controller, 800x550mm work area.

whirlybomber
Posts: 9
Joined: Thu Aug 08, 2013 5:40 am

Re: Random thought: double Y rail - Possible?

Post by whirlybomber » Tue Oct 15, 2013 11:57 pm

Hello jkanzaki,

To stiffen up my y-axis rails (I have extended to 1m in the y-direction) I used some 40mm*20mm*3mm aluminium C channel bolted between the bottom of the y-axis rails and the base board of the machine.

I set it up with the "C" facing out of the machine, and took 4mm off the flange under the rail so the v-wheel will still be able to ride on the makerslide, and you also need to be carefull about how the heads of bolts go pointing at each other and interfering (I had to grind away 1/2 the head of the lower wheel mounting bolts to get everything to slide correctly). I believe that with this modification I am likely to bend or break the plastic wheels before I bend the rails out of shape.

Unfortunately I don't have any pictures (or drawings) of what I've done as I sort of made it up as I went along.
ShapeOko 01 s/n 1910

jkanzaki
Posts: 166
Joined: Sat May 05, 2012 3:00 am

Re: Random thought: double Y rail - Possible?

Post by jkanzaki » Wed Oct 16, 2013 4:27 am

I am just curious if we double the y rail, would it make a different in anyway.
Shapeoko 1 - dissassemble
Shapeoko 2 - 1 x 1m expansion TinyG, superPid, Dw660, Aluminum extrusion bed, Nema 23, acme, Z axis upgrade, Dual Y
Shapeoko 3 - 0051 Stock Dw611, SuperPid, limit switch, 9mm belt

tweak
Posts: 34
Joined: Thu Aug 29, 2013 7:24 pm

Re: Random thought: double Y rail - Possible?

Post by tweak » Wed Oct 16, 2013 5:09 am

I think you'd have lots of problems with binding (is that the word?) and gantry racking. It's tricky already trying to square it with only one rail, but if you double it, I imagine it would be even more sensitive to twisting across the X axis.
I would go with bearings and linear shafts instead like these: http://www.probotix.com/index.php?view=category&path=34
ShapeOko hybrid, Dual X & Y Axis, ACME Z Axis, All NEMA 17, Kress 1050 FME-1 spindle (1.05KW), Steel V-Wheels & Hardcoat MakerSlide, Aluminum spacers, TinyG Controller, 800x550mm work area.

Gadgetman!
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Location: Norway
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Re: Random thought: double Y rail - Possible?

Post by Gadgetman! » Wed Oct 16, 2013 6:55 am

Those are 'out of stock'...
Weird guy...
Shapeoko 2014F: 1000mm X/Y, 300W Quiet Cut spindle, Arduino Uno/G-shield and GRBL 0.9i
15x30 drag chains, custom spindle mount, 9mm belts, 8mm endplates, 6mm motor plates.

tweak
Posts: 34
Joined: Thu Aug 29, 2013 7:24 pm

Re: Random thought: double Y rail - Possible?

Post by tweak » Wed Oct 16, 2013 7:20 am

ShapeOko hybrid, Dual X & Y Axis, ACME Z Axis, All NEMA 17, Kress 1050 FME-1 spindle (1.05KW), Steel V-Wheels & Hardcoat MakerSlide, Aluminum spacers, TinyG Controller, 800x550mm work area.

Improbable Construct
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Location: Fairhope, AL
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Re: Random thought: double Y rail - Possible?

Post by Improbable Construct » Wed Oct 16, 2013 7:22 am

There is no real need to double up the Y axis because you can add supports anywhere you want.
I have supports every 400 mm or two extra supports along my 1200 mm y axis.
I have seen that a couple of people have fully supported the whole length with MDF or metal angle stock.
Shapeoko #Classified some of the bolts may be original parts.
Shapeoko 1 # ???? Stainless plates, still in the box.
Shapeoko 2 # 3926 not stock
Shapeoko 3 # 0003
Store:
http://ImprobableConstruct.com
Twitter:
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jkanzaki
Posts: 166
Joined: Sat May 05, 2012 3:00 am

Re: Random thought: double Y rail - Possible?

Post by jkanzaki » Wed Oct 16, 2013 3:51 pm

Hey IC

What might those support look like ?
Shapeoko 1 - dissassemble
Shapeoko 2 - 1 x 1m expansion TinyG, superPid, Dw660, Aluminum extrusion bed, Nema 23, acme, Z axis upgrade, Dual Y
Shapeoko 3 - 0051 Stock Dw611, SuperPid, limit switch, 9mm belt

Improbable Construct
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Location: Fairhope, AL
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Re: Random thought: double Y rail - Possible?

Post by Improbable Construct » Wed Oct 16, 2013 4:40 pm

supports (Medium).jpg
supports (Medium).jpg (39.9 KiB) Viewed 2247 times
I just cut the top off of some endplates and bolted them to the makerslide and used some angle brackets to hold them to the table.
Shapeoko #Classified some of the bolts may be original parts.
Shapeoko 1 # ???? Stainless plates, still in the box.
Shapeoko 2 # 3926 not stock
Shapeoko 3 # 0003
Store:
http://ImprobableConstruct.com
Twitter:
https://twitter.com/ImprblConstruct

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